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LarryS
01-24-2006, 09:53 AM
Hello,

I'm interested in finding some info on tricks or tips on doing curved copper bay windows. I ordered the 14 books on cd but haven't received it yet, is there info on there about this?

My main interest is finding out how you roll the clips that go over the seams and maybe if there is a way to figure out the angle on the compound corners.

Right now I just bend up the straight pieces, crimp the 1" sides to get the curve I need and then tap on seam edge until it lines up well with other corner piece. It works out ok but is time consuming and you get some really strange looks by the people on the ground while your hammering a new piece of copper into shape :shock: :D

If anyone has the name of a book I can get or a catalog with specialized tools for this it would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance!!!!

Larry

Bud
01-24-2006, 07:00 PM
The CD is on the way, I was a couple of days behind due to being sick..I'm peddling as fast as CAN :)
Thanks for your patience, and your business is appreciated!

Thanks

mackeymetalroofing
05-04-2006, 03:38 PM
Hi Larry. I am doing a curved copper bay window right now and would really appreciate it if you could give me some insight into the making of the curved caps. Could you email me a phone number at vendors@mackeymetalroofing.com or call me toll-free at 1.866.434.8412 ext 701 (day or night!)? It would be really appreciated. Thanks.

David

bordontn
05-04-2006, 07:26 PM
Try [eastwoodco.com] for a shrinker/stretcher..My brother in S.W. Fla
uses one for compound curves on copper roofs...It will shrink or stretch the 1" stand-up. bordontn

mackeymetalroofing
05-04-2006, 09:09 PM
Thanks very much bordontn. Much appreciated. Just checked out the website and they have a video for the stretcher / shrinker that you are talking about. It looks like it is just what I am looking for. Thanks again. David

danski0224
05-05-2006, 07:33 PM
Cool stuff here: http://www.nabocker.com/index.cfm

SteveB
08-24-2006, 09:40 PM
Larry,
I don't know if you're still dealing with this, so please bear with me if so.
Procedures for rolling copper for radiused roofs varies with the type of roof made.
With bay windows, I use a crimp roll former to form the panels into the radius shapes.
For the "panel clips" I make a piece of 16ga. of the same general radius I formed of the panels. I then make a standard clip, and slowly form it to take the shape of the "jig" I've made. For 16 oz. copper this can take upwards of 45 minutes for each clip. It's a slow, steady process.
To mount the clips, it can be done in various ways. Here are two that I've used in time past.
1- rivet them to the panel ribs.
2- caulk them to the panel ribs.
In caulking them, one needs to have a clamping mechanism to hold them in place while the caulk cures.
For my kitchen hood-- Bud's got a photo somewhere-- I made a clamp jig with a 2x4 pc of wood.
I cut the 2x4 to the approriate length, then penciled the shape of the curve I'd made of the clip forming jig. I then took my jig saw, and cut that shape. Once I did that, I took a router, with a 1/4" slot cutter. To ensure that I keep a straight/true centerline cut, I made a spacer jig, that I could mount to the bottom of my router.
If you have any further questions about this, let me know, and I'll take some photos to demonstrate the procedures that I used.

bordontn
08-31-2006, 06:19 PM
SteveB...curious as to how this is flashed at the wall. Would this style
roof have to be installed before the brick or siding. Never done a concave or convex copper roof..Typically saw a reglet in the wall for the counter flashing..A straight cut...
"smart too late, old too soon" bordontn

SteveB
09-09-2006, 01:19 PM
Bordontn,
Flashed to wall varies with application-- brick, wood, stucco, and before, or after finish applied to wall.
For pre-finish application, it's easy-- or least more straightfoward than post.
For post-finish application on brick, one would need to counter-flash with a copper style counterflash.
For post-finish , on wood. You can do a "kerf" or reglet cut into the wood, and use the same counterflash you would on brick, but with a single course instead of stepped as in brick.
For post finish on stucco, you'll want to also do a kerf cut, and caulk the blazes out of it.
So, the moral of the story is-- if it's at all possible, try to do the install pre-finish.
I generally do a one inch flange on the panel, then make an attached flange to mount to the wall. In order to ensure the water-proofness of it, I solder the flange to the panels. It adds a bit of work, but makes certain that I don't have to drive back out there to fix leaks, and damage.
We're all too late in smart, and too old too quickly. Otherwise, we may not have become tin benders.

metalmanmania
11-11-2009, 08:13 PM
At the shop I work at, we have a curving machine that will curve the panels and the battens, as long as the panels are straight, not tapering at all. It works well, and I must say is quite tricky to master it. we have curved panels down to a 24inch radius and battens smaller then that.

Gus
01-26-2010, 03:15 PM
If anyone can help me on how to come up with the pattern to use for a copper dome. I know the easiest way is to have some specialized do it but that wasn't in the o.g plans

john_galt
01-27-2010, 01:53 AM
Size of dome? Where are you located, someone might recommend a shop close to you.
Best way is to hire a metal worker.

tnsam75
01-28-2010, 08:47 PM
Message me with size of dome, I can help.

cactassdupree
01-29-2010, 08:48 PM
Every one NEEDS to learn how to solder if U want to B a meatl worker Right ?? :) dupree

cactassdupree
01-29-2010, 08:49 PM
Metal f in pc or key board peace matt

Gus
02-01-2010, 06:27 PM
Message me with size of dome, I can help.

hey thanks for responding "tnsam 75" anyhow, the dome I need has to have a 94" diameter, but my biggest problem is that it has to be 40" tall. I know if you get my pic. but I hope you can give me an idea.

tnsam75
02-01-2010, 09:29 PM
Your Radius is 47-5/8", and your panel length in the center is 67-1/8" without allowances for anything like a starter hem. That is a tight measurement, to zero in the center. This Job would take 19 tapered 16" pans. Hope this helps.

john_galt
02-02-2010, 12:32 PM
Didn't mean to sound so harsh Gus. When I read my reply,didn't sound so good, sorry.

tnsam75
02-02-2010, 07:56 PM
Classy move John Galt- Nice to see humanity at work in the shop.
Gus,
Now that I have a second more to talk to you, the 16" pans will leave you with a half panel to finish. I would suggest 14" panels, 21 should cover with no "weird panels" at the end. You'd be best to get a big roll of rosin paper and make a template that you can try all around your dome. keep adjusting till you feel good about it and start your estimation from there. With the compound radius involved, fitting the pattern piece will be tough.

MattM
02-02-2010, 09:29 PM
I've seen panel stretching machines, that take machined copper panels and allow you to stretch them in or out for concave and convex curves. Anyone know where you get machines like that, or approximately how much they cost?

bordontn2
02-04-2010, 02:32 PM
MattM...........try eastwood.com shrinker/stretcher $170 and up
bordontn2

tnsam75
02-04-2010, 07:12 PM
Hey Bordo! How ya been?
Matt,
I use a Schlebach RBM panel radius machine. It will radius 1" and 1-1/2" 1300's and T-panels. I have used it to do convex-concave pans, but it's a huge PIA! I have to use the machine for the vexed part and pipe crimpers to get the concave to lay in. The battens I have to do all by hand, stretching the concaves and shrinking the arches. It takes forever but the jobs usually pay well. This only works on T-pans.
But, the machine is great for plain old single radius panels. It can be a pain to set up, never uses the same settings twice so you kinda "start from scratch" for each job. But, once you set it up your rockin and rollin. We can even transport it to the customer's job site and run panels and radius them right on sight.
Very nice money maker.

Gus
02-05-2010, 12:31 AM
No worries John Galt, I must've sounded a little out of my leage there too.
tnsam75,
Hey thanks for the info, I tried your suggestion and it worked quite well. Of course it took some playing around but I think I finally got it.I'm glad I joined this site and found very good help, thanks again.

MattM
02-05-2010, 01:04 PM
Thanks for the replies, fellas!

Apprentice
02-07-2010, 11:50 AM
Hello,

I'm interested in finding some info on tricks or tips on doing curved copper bay windows. I ordered the 14 books on cd but haven't received it yet, is there info on there about this?

My main interest is finding out how you roll the clips that go over the seams and maybe if there is a way to figure out the angle on the compound corners.

Right now I just bend up the straight pieces, crimp the 1" sides to get the curve I need and then tap on seam edge until it lines up well with other corner piece. It works out ok but is time consuming and you get some really strange looks by the people on the ground while your hammering a new piece of copper into shape :shock: :D

If anyone has the name of a book I can get or a catalog with specialized tools for this it would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance!!!!

Larry

I'ma Accualy learning this in school right now. My teacher showed some "New" tools on the market that get this done quicker. I'll try to find the website (if there is one).

Tucko
03-07-2010, 05:52 PM
I've seen panel stretching machines, that take machined copper panels and allow you to stretch them in or out for concave and convex curves. Anyone know where you get machines like that, or approximately how much they cost?

We've rented them before. You can truck it right to the jobsite and roll your panels and battens onsite. However, it only rolls straight panels, so it wouldn't help you on a dome roof.