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Post subject:57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
 Posted: Aug 12, 2004 - 02:27 AM #1544
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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| Well what can I say, not much to work with this time. This is the tunnel, floor pan and partial fire wall. Any suggestions?????? |
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Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
www.air-specialty.com
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 12, 2004 - 07:13 AM #1547
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Tinner
Joined: Jun 12, 2004
Posts: 18
Location: southern illinois
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Price,
allot of it looks good from here? I am asuming there is rusted out parts? if you can make a paper pattern
or a tape pattern, to give you something to follow. Like most car these were stamped out and making them
by hand, you will have to break it up into workable size pcs.(nothing earth shattering) Do you have a bead roller? or a pullmax machine? these will give you the ability to joggle or offset the edge, bead (stifffen) panels. now you probably won't have the exact dies set, with the pullmax the dies are pretty simple to make,
bead roller little more work on a lathe. A really lo-tech way is to hammerform into a block of wood it works,
but is very slow. Does this car have large tail FINS? i saw a Desoto in Iowa Monday, but was too tired to take pics of it black and gold, nicely restored. My latest project is i came up with a Butler fuel delivery tank,
to add to my 33 Chevy 1 1/2 ton farm truck.
Let me know if i can help!
tt |
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 12, 2004 - 12:39 PM #1548
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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When the part arrived at the shop it looked bad. After 3 hours of carefully removing some type of tar coating what looks like good metal, it started to look a bit better. I will finish cleaning the part tonight and make the surface good enough to get the template. I do not have a pullmax but do have a couple of bead rollers. The hammer forming is most likely the way I will go. Will a hardwood form get the job done? I will admite the part looked some what simple to do, but after removing the tar its a bit more tricky. I will make the part from 16 gage hot rolled. Still can't find the right grade of CR.I was thinking I would clean the surface well and paint it, making it easier to apply the trans tape. If you can tell me how you would break the panel up it would be a good step. I will study the part more today and try to figure something out.
On another project last night, I have a weld joint the was on a curved piece of 16 gage that would pop in and out. I felt like the joint was stretched a bit and it allowed the pop. I remembered seeing a video on the shrinking disc and not having one, i used a soft dics in a grinder and slowly applied a gradual amount of heat to the joint an then applied water to it. The water made a slight amount of steam and the pop went away. Was this just luck or what?
I will have more questions for sure, Thanks for the help. |
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Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 13, 2004 - 02:55 AM #1549
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Tinner
Joined: Jun 12, 2004
Posts: 18
Location: southern illinois
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Price,
if it is on a weld joint, it would be shrunk(heat shrinks) now oil canning would be stretch on a flatter
surface. Gas welding allows you to hammerweld, the weld is soft so it can be hit back into place. mig
and tig have less heat shrink but are much harder (than gas welds) and are much harder to hammer
back into shape.
on the shrink disc, i dont have one but have seen it in use a few times, the friction between the metals
is what generates heat, flat on the disc and high spots on the metal
it works like a torch would, also have heard guys say they can do it with out ruining the base coat????
don't know about that??? may work in a small area???
Remember that a high spot on one side is a low spot on the other! isn't metalwork fun!
on the wooden hammer forms you may spend more time on the forms than the metal, do you have a shot
or sand bag??? this will help you stretch, shrinking the tucking tool will work.
How much detail??? hard to tell from the pics what all needs to be done, allot of little stuff can take longer than the big stuff!
Take care!
tt |
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 13, 2004 - 03:04 AM #1550
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Tinner
Joined: Jun 12, 2004
Posts: 18
Location: southern illinois
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Price, on breaking the part up, well if you split it into pcs that are easy to work with, i have short arms and
small hands so i may make things smaller than someone taller/long arms. the details such as stiffening beads, bends, joggles will help you make that desicion. the bigger the pc = less welds. also how you put it back into the car can you weld the pcs in without knocking them out of alignment?
I am thinking that your beading will dictate, the center(driveshaft) tunnel will need to be seperate, all you need is some kirksite a really big press BANG! it's done!!! i wish it was that easy!
From what i have heard that all c.r. is of a a.k. aluminum killed steel, D.Q. draw quality is somewhat softer
but is hard to find.
Hope this helps!
good luck!
tt |
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 13, 2004 - 05:02 AM #1551
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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This helps alot. I have a better camera for tommorow and I will get some better pics and repace the ones that are posted now. I will put the trans tape on tommorow night, maybe, if the paint has dryed enough. I will draw on the pattern how I will cut it a part and I will document this process much better that the last. I will gather my thoughts tommorow and I am sure I will have many more questions, more specific questions. The e wheel is still in pieces and will be for a few more days, maybe weeks , who knows at this point, very busy. Built conductor heads and down spouts today an some more tommorow. All from painted aluminum. Cant wait to try shaping aluminum, I have some .125 hidden to play with.
Thanks , more tommorow.... |
_________________
Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
www.air-specialty.com
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 14, 2004 - 08:26 PM #1553
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 15, 2004 - 03:58 AM #1554
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Tinner
Joined: Jun 12, 2004
Posts: 18
Location: southern illinois
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Price i will make some assumptions you cut them out they dont bolt in? Start with the center "tunnel", on some parts you can use a simple s/m rolls, the taper will roll too., the trans-cover fairly flat, shrink the
outer edges then form over "T" dollies, then bend the outer flange up after that. i'd assemble the tunnel, then move on to the flat work. Here if you can make each side in one pc? if not halves depending on that
bumpup/stiffener, it maybe easier to work that into the end of a panel rather than the middle. All 16 gauge?
man that car is like armour plated! You are going to love working with 18/19/20 gauge!
leave youself some extra metal, but in the heavy shrinking area, as little as you can get by with, easier to stretch, than to shrink! as for as welding a joggle/overlap should be ok.
As you do one side keep in mind that other is a mirror image(or close) you may(should ) learn making one side and do the other better/faster. one other thing as you make the beads/stiffners you may need to stretch
the metal a bit as the bead will take up some metal as you form them,, look for wavy or ripples in the flat area, hammer smooth(planishing hammer wroks good or you ewheel.
Good luck!
tt |
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 15, 2004 - 06:03 AM #1555
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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Terry,
My skills in shrinking are not that good as of yet. I have been thinking about it today and I will most likely keep each section of the pan as simple as possible. I know this will cause me to have too many weld joints I am sure. Need to work on that as well. Maybe thats the answer for me now???? I will keep practicing on the bag with the mallets, keep on learning. I took the weekend off and will start back Monday night, should be intresting.Once the flexable pattern is complete, and before removing it, I will take more pics of how I will break the pattern up and see what you think.
Thanks for the advice,
Pricer |
_________________
Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
www.air-specialty.com
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 15, 2004 - 06:06 AM #1556
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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Terry,
Do you ever come to the metalmeet's in Huntsville, Alabama? I have been talking to a fellow named Kerry from there and he said there may be another one there in December. Towards the end of October I am planning to visit his shop and play with a Pullmax or two, sounds like fun to me. His place is about 7 hours from me, I live on the Gulf of Mexico, hurricane alley!!!!!! Too many of them out there lately. |
_________________
Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
www.air-specialty.com
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 18, 2004 - 04:17 AM #1559
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Tinner
Joined: Jun 12, 2004
Posts: 18
Location: southern illinois
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Price,
Yes on the Formfests in 01 and 02 i drove 700 miles out of the way to spend about 24 hrs at Huntsville!
i go to Hershey in the fall swap meet, if you have never seen Hershey or spring Carlisle well you haven't been to a real swap meet! Now you can learn alot from Kerry Pinkerton, just a few years ago he was just starting out and now he builds and sell ewheels and Chrysler parts, in fact i just caught up with him a couple
of weeks ago in Sedalia Mo. Memorial weekend of 03 i was in that area, we were in New Orleans, then went to Mobile, don't remember why we went there??? There is a Metal Meet 04 coming in Illinois at the end of
October, last year event had approximately 150 people, Cars N Parts magazine covered it in the April issue.
If you look real hard you can find me pictured in the article, ya they got the name wrong! last name is Thorne and i do my best work on the Throne! If you get to meet George King, say hi for me! he hosted the
1st two Form fests,(metal meet- form fest confusing? well there are 2 groups and there is some competition
between the two) More than half of what you here about the other group is true, if that much!
now to the metal shaping part!
One reason for saying break it up small is that you can mig weld the joints to add strength to the part, as it will be under mats and undercoated? you don't see the joints, now with panels you see as few of joints as
you can get by with, less metal finishing(smoothing weld joints) saves times and the arms, hands, shoulders,
you get the idea!
If you can make one of these national meet or a local you will learn so much everyone does it a little differently and you can pick up so much for doing it another way, one of my favorite sayings is
" more than one way to skin a cat, uh i mean door!"
Take care!
tt |
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 18, 2004 - 11:11 AM #1560
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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Hello Terry,
I intend on going to Kerry's in October, I think I can learn allot if I could spend the day there. He said something about a meet in December at his place, would you be there? I spent some time gas welding yesterday and I think with some more practice I can get it. The heat required to weld the 16 gage did not warp the material nearly as bad as I thought. I hope to use this process in the floor pan and if it fails me , its back to the mig. I will finish the pattern today and remove it. I have cut it up into several parts, I hope that is not to big of a mistake. I said when I finished the quarter panel that I would minimize the weld joint, but now I cant see a way around it. Wray from metalmeet says its a difficult part to make, lots of twist and turns, it does look somewhat simple on the surface, the bosses think so but, I think time will tell a different story.
This week will be busy, a group of the guys from my shop and some of our suppliers have have donated our time to building a wheelchair ramp for a family that has suffered a great loss recently. I was chosen to design the ramp and construction begins this evening. I also told the owner of the floor pan that it would be ready next Tuesday. Time to get it done.
Thanks,
Pricer |
_________________
Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
www.air-specialty.com
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 20, 2004 - 10:45 PM #1567
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Tinner
Joined: Jun 12, 2004
Posts: 18
Location: southern illinois
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Price,
don't get discouraged if something doesn't work the first couple of times, what you are making is a hard pc.
Being 16 ga has it's advantages and disadvantages, your trying to do what a large press did. Gas welding
is something even if you do every week or so, still takes a few minutes to get the hang of things, like riding
a bike.
If i can help just let me know.
I have been having some computer troubles here as it likes to lock up when connecting to the website,
don't know why it asks me every page do you want to continue to run scripts on each page???
Take care!
tt |
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 20, 2004 - 11:40 PM #1568
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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oldgoaly wrote:
Price,
don't get discouraged if something doesn't work the first couple of times, what you are making is a hard pc.
Being 16 ga has it's advantages and disadvantages, your trying to do what a large press did. Gas welding
is something even if you do every week or so, still takes a few minutes to get the hang of things, like riding
a bike.
If i can help just let me know.
I have been having some computer troubles here as it likes to lock up when connecting to the website,
don't know why it asks me every page do you want to continue to run scripts on each page???
Take care!
tt Thanks for the encouragement. It has been a very busy week, not allowing me much time to work on the floor pan. I have a bushhog deck to build in the morning, work on my shape pattern a bit and then its off to finish the wheel chair ramp. Next week in the evenings I will get back on the floor pan. I will have more questions then, time is getting a way fast.
Thanks...... |
_________________
Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
www.air-specialty.com
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Aug 24, 2004 - 01:51 AM #1572
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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| Don't give up on me and the Desoto flood pan yet. I have been very busy, orders for duct coming in daily. Got to get it while the getting is good. My shop is getting full! |
_________________
Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
www.air-specialty.com
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Post subject:RE: 57' Desoto Floor Pan Project
Posted: Oct 02, 2004 - 07:30 PM #1683
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Pro Tinner
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 826
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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| Desoto floor pan is still in the corner of the shop. Its still on the "To Do" list. The recent hurricane has many things changed at the moment. Everyone's priorities have changed but, things will get back to normal soon I hope. Still looking for the 1005 thru 1008 cold roll steel in 18 gage. Think we are getting close! |
_________________
Pricer
Many Minds, Many Hands, Many Solutions
Air Specialty
www.air-specialty.com
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