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Post subject:Stainless Steel Soldering
 Posted: Apr 20, 2004 - 02:30 AM #692
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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Is it possible to solder stainless steel? I have information about soldering, but nothing on stainless steel. Is there another option to sealing a standing seam with some type of chemical based sealer, such as gutter seal or some type of polymer? I cut the template for the elliptical stainless steel tank for the water fall project today, among many other things. The wall behind the tank must be water proofed and many ideas have been tossed around. One was to cover the wall with EPDM roofing material, but I think the rubber would not react well with the adhesive that will be used to secure the granite to the wall and the fact that hanging granite on rubber is not a good idea to begin with. Lol
I was thinking in I were to build a multi sheet cover on the wall that will provide a flat surface for the granite to adhere to, that it would be my best option. The durability of the stainless steel and the contact with the water this should be a good combination. The granite is being removed from an old historic building downtown as we speak. The way I understand it is, they will be laid like tiles in the wall with a .125” clearance between the tiles. That means water will be able to travel between the seams of the granite.
What I proposed was to make a wall cover from 3 sheets of 18 gage stainless steel and seam them together using a one inch standing seam. The seams will run vertically incase water is able to get into the seam it will travel down through the seam and into the tank. Also thought about installing the seam horizontally with the female of the standing seam on the bottom panel to catch water as it may try to get through. The seam would be turned to the wall and a slot will be cut into the wall to accept the seam.
The seam it self will act as a deterrent for the water as well as the solder or sealer. Soldiering seems like to best idea. How would you do it? I have read some about soldering but I have never tried it as I have heard it described here. Any help at all will be appreciated.
Thank You
Pricer |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 20, 2004 - 02:35 AM #693
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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Sorry , Ihave posted the same pdf some how.
pricer |
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Pricer
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Post subject:solder stainless
Posted: Apr 20, 2004 - 03:24 AM #694
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Power User
Joined: Apr 17, 2004
Posts: 250
Location: Central Ohio
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| Pricer, what about a joint that looks like this one? Easier to bend and no cutting into the wall. Just something off of the top of my heae! |
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Steve
Blissfully Ignorant Copperhead
www.copperthings.com
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 20, 2004 - 03:40 AM #695
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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That is a great suggestion! We were concerned about how it may effect the granite. That would be a good way. I my just be counting hairs here, by the time they spread their adhesive it most likely will not mater any way. What do you think? They are going the glue the tiles to the wal any way. Lots of people turning away from this part of the project because of the liability involved. Go figure.
Thank You, Pricer
PS. I really like your drawing, looks like something I would do. I think I have turned into a CAD junkie! lol |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 20, 2004 - 01:14 PM #696
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Power User
Joined: Apr 17, 2004
Posts: 250
Location: Central Ohio
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Pricer, In thinking about it, I seem to remember that SS expands and contracts more than steel. If this be the case, I would think about laying out the joints so that they would occur in the grout joints and then no tile would be spaning the metal joints. This would reduce the possibility of movement along the joint affecting any tiles. As for water in that joint, I don't think so. Hey as long as you are not ultimately responsible for the tile setters work, why shy away?
Steve |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 20, 2004 - 03:29 PM #697
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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True it is. I just came back from a meeting with the owners, looks like we will cover the wall after all with the methods you had suggested. I printed your drawing, they saw it and choose the layer the stainless that way. Do you really think I would have a problem with expantion? The one detail I missed telling every one was that this water fall was in doors in a conditioned space. Once the water and stainless has reached room temp. and there are no apparent leaks the stainless should not move much is what i am thinking. The joints in the ss on the wall will overlap 6". Give me your thoughts.
Thank You , Pricer |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 20, 2004 - 05:35 PM #698
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Power User
Joined: Apr 17, 2004
Posts: 250
Location: Central Ohio
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| Pricer, Indoors-No problem with expansion there. If your decision on a six inch overlap is about the water, I wouldn't waste the metal. I don't believe I would overlap horizontal seams anymore than an inch or so. A horizontal seam like that is not going to wick mosture beyond the lap, especially if you incoporate some type of gasket or sealant in the joint. Vertical seams, where the water flow is going to run along the seam, would need a wider overlap and at least two distinct gasket or sealant lines before the water could reach the inside. Well anyway, I'm glad it is working out for you. |
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Blissfully Ignorant Copperhead
www.copperthings.com
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 20, 2004 - 10:44 PM #699
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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Thanks a lot for your help. What do you think about gutter seal. I am not reffering to any polymer but something that is solvent based, like the product made by Alcoa. It comes in a metal tube similar to tooth paste. I used 2 tubes of it today on my aluminum roof cap project which turned out quite well. I have to put some small flashing around it in the morning due to small elevation change. Thanks again for your help.
Pricer |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 21, 2004 - 01:17 AM #700
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Joined: Mar 17, 2004
Posts: 16
Location: USA Ga
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| Back to original question, We solder stainless all the time. Forget the name of flux (Stay clear I think) at the moment, but it comes in paste or liquid and we get it next door at CC Dickson Company, a HVAC supply house. |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 21, 2004 - 01:26 AM #701
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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Triple wrote:
Back to original question, We solder stainless all the time. Forget the name of flux (Stay clear I think) at the moment, but it comes in paste or liquid and we get it next door at CC Dickson Company, a HVAC supply house. What type of solder do you use? What size copper? You are dealing with a person who has never soldered much at all. What I had tryed was a misreble faliure! I bought a torch set once that came with a 1 lbs iron that attached to the torch body, would something like this work? |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 21, 2004 - 09:37 AM #704
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Power User
Joined: May 14, 2003
Posts: 212
Location: Sydney Australia
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Pricer,
For mine 70% tin 30% lead and the biggest iron you can find others use the oxy torch for heat source see below, phosphoric acid based flux.
A tip I got from another source:
Quote
Stainless steel flux - Back when I did a lot of this (1980s), I used
Eutectic Castolin #157 for soft solder. The castolin website appears to
suck rocks, so I can't confirm the number or that the stuff is still
made now. Clean the metal well mechanically (brush, scotchbrite or
sandpaper) first, flux quickly.
An OA torch with a long feather (absurdly carburizing flame) works
nicely, as the long flame can be laid along the joint (stainless is a
poor heat conductor).
95/5 tin/antimony works well for solder.
End quote
Glenn |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 21, 2004 - 04:10 PM #705
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Power User
Joined: Sep 03, 2003
Posts: 171
Location: edinburgh
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| what is the wall behind t he granite made of is it concrete if so this can be sealed with a bitumastic paint ,also how are the granite tiles being attached are these being bonded |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 21, 2004 - 08:43 PM #706
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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marky wrote:
what is the wall behind t he granite made of is it concrete if so this can be sealed with a bitumastic paint ,also how are the granite tiles being attached are these being bonded Water proof sheet rock is what will be behind the granite. That is why we think stainless steel is a good material to use . What is bitumastic paint ? |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 23, 2004 - 01:12 PM #714
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Power User
Joined: Sep 03, 2003
Posts: 171
Location: edinburgh
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| bitumastic paint is a tar like paint used as a protection in water tanks [where the water is not drunk ]and below the damp course of concrete or brick buildings |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 23, 2004 - 06:20 PM #717
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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marky wrote:
bitumastic paint is a tar like paint used as a protection in water tanks [where the water is not drunk ]and below the damp course of concrete or brick buildings Thank you for the info. I will look deeper into the paint. Sounds like something that could have some alt. uses. Learn something new everyday! Thanks |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Apr 28, 2004 - 08:54 PM #748
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Joined: May 14, 2003
Posts: 212
Location: Sydney Australia
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: May 04, 2004 - 01:58 AM #817
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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I need more help with soldering stainless steel. Someone that brazes alot at my shop tryed with 50/50 and it would not stick. They then used 45% silver in the joint and then capped the braze with the solder. It was a tough joint and did not break. I am going to try to solder the test parts in the morning. If any one would like to give me step by step details, now would be a good time. I have never had a successful solder joint and I must conquer this! Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
From what I am reading from various sources, my problem of the metal not sticking together is from the material not being clean. The solder would only bead up in the joint. When removed from the clamp the pieces would fall apart. How should the metal be cleaned? |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: May 05, 2004 - 12:09 AM #819
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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This is a picture of a solder joint made in 10 gage stainless steel. The solder was 50/50 and a flux caller rudy fluid. The metal was cleaned with alcohol. After the alcohol evaporated, rudy fluid was applied and heated. Once the heat was applied the solder was flowed into the joint. I was not there at the shop when this was done but, the joint was strong and the stainless had no discoloration. I am going to try it tommorow. Tell me was you think!
Thanks, |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Feb 01, 2005 - 01:05 PM #2477
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Joined: Jan 31, 2005
Posts: 7
Location: australia
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i know this is a year to late..... but im only new here. we solder stainless shower trays with either 50/50 or 60/40 for flux we use killed hydrochloric acid ( regular plumbers hydrochloric acid from hardware store with smal pieces of galv droped in till it stops fizzing. Usually works a treat, sticking very easliy and seems very strong.
p.s. i know no one will read this cause youve long since finished your project. Sorry pricer |
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Post subject:RE: Stainless Steel Soldering
Posted: Feb 01, 2005 - 04:33 PM #2479
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Power User
Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 820
Location: Mobile, Alabama
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| Personally, I re-read these post as needed. These forums serve me as a library of information. Welcome to the shop! This is very useful information, free free to share and exchange ideas here, they are greatly appreciated. |
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